I'm normally the first to scream from the rooftops about MSHSAA's ineptitude. Make no mistake, there's plenty of it to go around. But what could/should they do here?
Cooter vs Principia
- Thread starter Ftballfan16
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Do you honestly think that's the most fair thing that could come of this? Say they do that, and Cooter gets boatraced. Think Cooter's fans are going to tip their hat? Come on now, they're going to immediately point back to "getting screwed out of 2 points and a win".
My apologies if this has already been posted.
Column: For the Cooter community, a life lesson learned
There are a lot of things that the student-athletes who competed in the recent MSHSAA Class 2 Quarterfinal 1 boy's basketball game between Cooter High School and The Principia School can learn. However, no lesson should resonate more so than, in life: Watch what people do, not what they say.
www.semoball.com
Its just a bad situation all around. Losing like that is rough and, in reality, no one wants to win like that either. LIFE IS NOT ALWAYS FAIR.
I have no idea how they would react. Neither do you. You can speculate all you want. All I am saying is the only fair thing to do would of been to replay the game. You think playing the second half of that game Cooter is not looking at the scoreboard thinking how they got screwed. Hard to focus with that on the back of your mind. Principia as well. I just think that at the time MSHSAA should have declared the game a no contest and played it again a few days later. MSHSAA chose to do what they always do....Nothing.
We forbid them on our manufacturing and shipping floors and in the Lab for this very reason. Just now reading this thread it is UNBELIEVABLE anything like this would ever happen!
You're correct, it's just speculation. But I think most would admit the only thing that would truly make the Cooter folks happy is if they're just somehow allowed to move on.
I don't think replaying the game is the only fair thing. I'm not sure there is a fair thing to do. Replaying that game isn't really fair to Principia.
And, yes, Cooter probably thought that. But here's the thing that hasn't been discussed. And I've avoided it until now. Everyone thinks Principia's coach and scorers should've done the right thing or have insinuated that they have an obligation to right the wrong. How about this? Cooter's coach or staff could've provided officials with an explanation of the THREE TOTAL FIELD GOALS scored by them in the game to that point. I that had happened, it's pretty likely everyone (officials and scorers) comes to the realization the score was incorrect and they fix it. But that didn't happen. Cooter wants to blame everyone else, but...
It is a crazy situation, and i have thought a lot about this. I don't think replaying the game is the fair thing to do. I think the only thing close to really fair is scoring the game from video and if Cooter is ahead at end of regulation then awarding them the victory. But that is not truly fair either as the game would have been played differently in the last few mins if the score was correct. So there really is no fair thing to do. It sucks all around. Cooter will forever think they have won. Principia will always have doubts about their "win". Both coaches and teams will carry this one for quite awhile.
I think it is important for MSHSAA to make some clarifications in this offseason about the protest system and what teams are supposed to do in these situations. Hopefully we can stop this from ever happening again. And for petes sake keep all people at the scorers table off their stinking phones.
I think it is important for MSHSAA to make some clarifications in this offseason about the protest system and what teams are supposed to do in these situations. Hopefully we can stop this from ever happening again. And for petes sake keep all people at the scorers table off their stinking phones.
If that article posted above is correct (both teams books and 2 media outlets books all had the score) then that is really bad.
I have known several times, keeping book or the clock that we have all talked back and forth, 'who scored that, who was that foul on?, etc.) That is really sad.
I have known several times, keeping book or the clock that we have all talked back and forth, 'who scored that, who was that foul on?, etc.) That is really sad.
I just read an account of this that says it was a 2 point FG that was removed and it was on both teams book AND two media outlets that were covering the game. 4 against one is pretty big odds.
The protest system and rectifying a scoring mistake are already quite clear. It is up to coaches to know how these things work. It would be interesting to know the officials' thought process and what information they were given on the court as well.
My apologies if this has already been posted.
Column: For the Cooter community, a life lesson learned
There are a lot of things that the student-athletes who competed in the recent MSHSAA Class 2 Quarterfinal 1 boy's basketball game between Cooter High School and The Principia School can learn. However, no lesson should resonate more so than, in life: Watch what people do, not what they say.www.semoball.com
That is a wildly unfair column in my opinion. Laying the blame on Principia and questioning their ethics, morals, and faith is an odd take on this situation but I guess it plays well down in Cooter.
Agreed. The whole "christian" narrative needs to be left out.
First I have to say I feel bad for the kids. This may be an unpopular opinion, but the team had 3 and half quarters plus and overtime period to change the outcome. It's not like it happened with no time left and you were just stuck with the outcome. Unfortunately people are human and make mistakes. Once the decisions was made you have to try and put it behind you and keep playing. Looking at the score when it happened seems they got a boost from it vs them hanging their heads and giving up because something didn't go their way. For that I have great respect for those kids.
I reckon this all pales in comparison to what the coaches, players and community of Salisbury are goin through. Maybe it's time to let this thread fade away.
I only posted the article because it was the first article I could find telling what happened during the game. SemoBall is usually a reliable site.
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You have got to be kidding me!! The reason you keep a scorebook is to keep track of how many points have been scored. The markings in the scorebook are the explanation. They did provide it and it was correct. The evidence provided by the Principia scorer was incorrect. You can debate why it was incorrect but it was incorrect. Two reasons this happened the Official scorer screwed up and the Principia Scorer provided an incorrect score, but in your take Cooter was to blame? This is just a terrible take.
it's behind a paywall, but get this quote from the article.My apologies if this has already been posted.
Column: For the Cooter community, a life lesson learned
There are a lot of things that the student-athletes who competed in the recent MSHSAA Class 2 Quarterfinal 1 boy's basketball game between Cooter High School and The Principia School can learn. However, no lesson should resonate more so than, in life: Watch what people do, not what they say.www.semoball.com
Mathis had his scorebook to present as evidence to the contrary, as well as Principia’s scorebook, and the scorebook from two media outlets, both of whom were televising the game.
“Four different scorebooks,” Mathis said, “and (the scorekeeper) refused to look at and refused to change.”
So the Principia scorebook keeper had the correct score and presented it. Wow, in that case everyone including both coaching staffs' knew the score was wrong. Everyone except the stubborn and incompetent scorekeeper.
Its even worse than I thought it was.
If Principia allowed their book to compare and both schools were exact, the score should have been corrected. Kudos to Principia if they did allow their book to be compared.
It would have been easy to find the error if both team scorebooks showed the exact player with one more FG than the official book at the table. At that point, the referees could have got both coaches together to explain the situation that it would be impossible for both team scorebooks to have the exact same mistake with an exact player having an extra FG than the official book. I doubt if any coach would object to getting the score right when presented with that evidence.
I have always heard the rule "You can't change the official scorebook". If that is the exact rule with no exceptions, I guess the refs felt like their hands were tied in that situation.
It would have been easy to find the error if both team scorebooks showed the exact player with one more FG than the official book at the table. At that point, the referees could have got both coaches together to explain the situation that it would be impossible for both team scorebooks to have the exact same mistake with an exact player having an extra FG than the official book. I doubt if any coach would object to getting the score right when presented with that evidence.
I have always heard the rule "You can't change the official scorebook". If that is the exact rule with no exceptions, I guess the refs felt like their hands were tied in that situation.
Principia had the right score and changed it when the points were taken off the board.
Which makes the overall opinion, written apparently by Cooters head cheerleader, that much worse.
That disgusting drivel set the integrity of journalism back 100 years.
Instead of focusing his narrative on the scorekeeper/official(s) who got the score wrong, he reports that Principia had the score correct and did the right thing by presenting the information.
But apparently that’s not enough..
He then goes on to attack Principia‘s sense of morality, character, integrity and religious convictions because they won’t step aside and allow the losing team to advance.
WTFH?
Which begs the obvious question since there are an incalculable number of circumstances in which a mistake by the officials could impact the final outcome: under what circumstances should the winning team step aside for the losers or risk having their character and religious convictions called into question by Ole Tom?
Maybe the character test the author of this claptrap missed is the one he himself failed.
The outcome of a high school sporting event shouldnt be so important to you that you crawl into the sewer and become a pig.
yes, they didn't do anything dishonest, they simply accepted the ruling by the refs and changed the book as a result of the ruling. They were not guilty in any way of the score being wrong, they conducted themselves as they should have. I feel for the situation they were put in.
To me the honorable thing would have been to forfeit the game when it was tied in regulation because you know you really are two points behind. But you are going to feel enormous pressure to rationalize that the strategy would have been different or to treat it just as any other bad call or lucky break. So in reality close to 100% of coaches would have done that, including probably the Cooter coach. I doubt very seriously I would have done any different than the Principia Coach did. I know he doesn't have a great feeling about how it went down. The kids from both teams deserve better.
I do have a much more positive feeling about this whole situation knowing that Principia had nothing to do with why the score was wrong, they tried to correct the score. Kudos to them, and sorry for both teams.
He's not a pig, but he is expecting too much. Almost nobody, if anybody at all would give up the game if it played out this way. I think forfeiting was the correct thing to do, but I don't believe anyone but Jesus himself could bring themselves to actually do it.
I will say as an official that if both books have a made field goal and the total score matches up AND the individual player scoring matches up, I would have a very hard time ignoring that and staying with the main book at the table. The officials should also be aware of the score and ideally should notice if points come off the board at some point for an unexplained reason. With high school games not using replay, game awareness is even more important.
With the technology we have available today, I think this is an instance that the video should be used.
Why is just the score keeper being blamed what about the 3 officials. They all looked at all 3 scorebooks but just went on with the one at the table. You would have thought they would have went with the 2 out of 3 being right theory and changed it but they did not.
It would have to be some sort of standardized system, which is way too costly for regular season or even district level games. It could more easily be implemented for sectional games on, but entire rule changes would have to happen first.
saw the protestors at the state tournament this weekend, probably a bit much,,,,...but i agreed with them, cooter got screwed. also BTW, the thayer vs higginsville (laf. county) game today had numerous scoreboard errors , (people going Krazy in the stands) but the official book was correct and that is what counts.
