I’m sure all sides are excited for it. Big 8 football isn’t the same without Seneca being good and hard nosed. Fun to watch.
Impact of the class 1 cap
- Thread starter thesnowflakegazette
- Start date
I watched both Class 2 and Class 3 championships last year and thought Lamar and Blair Oaks both could have competed for the Class 3 title.
Watched both wire to wire as well and agree. Ritter would have had a near impossible task stopping either offense. Also note for this upcoming season I think they will find Class 4 pretty darned difficult. Not an "automatic" #1 as so many STL privates seem to be these days.
The bye week would be huge! Let's compromise 22 classes with 14 teams.
How about the impact before the class 1 cap? MSHAA basically eliminated half of small school football in SWMO, and decimated WEMO in the last 25 years with the previous setup. Having class 1 be the fill in class makes a huge amount of sense. Getting to watch 32 kids win a state championship beats the ehll out of watching some STL private school, or a big KC suburb win one.
Mississippi just expanded to 7 classes with ~26 per class. It's ridiculous.
Ha! You Preppys should come out to Cali! 15 divisions and the state is divided by north and south!
It's incredible how short-sighted and late MSHSAA was on this (and most things).
Wonder if they finally figured out small town football draws the numbers. When a class 1 school plays the whole town shows up. And then some. Everyone is related to or knows someone on the team. Or they played there and come back to support. Or there's literally nothing else to do and it's a social event.
You don't get that as often in bigger classes and very rarely in 'big' schools.
Guess the bean counters musta gone to a stl area private school where they don't get that.
10 years too late and it's costing them $$$$$
I'm sure they are, but this isn't the way. When they did this the two participants from the Class 5 championship last year got split, so now there's 3 classes 4,5, and 6 that are all foregone conclusions.
I’m just cracking jokes. I think there’s things to solve, but not sure what the answers are.
That was about Mississippi but all good. I still would love to know the exact date the MO class and district assignments are coming.
https://twitter.com/MO8ManFootball
@MO8ManFootball
·
Jul 30
District assignments are scheduled to be released on August 25th.
https://twitter.com/MO8ManFootball/status/1685790188838985729/analytics
@MO8ManFootball
·
Jul 30
District assignments are scheduled to be released on August 25th.
https://twitter.com/MO8ManFootball/status/1685790188838985729/analytics
bet you 100 bucks some rock 'man' never paid me MSHSAA has them all printed and ready to send out at this very moment.
There.
Will.
Be.
Zero.
Change.
From.
What.
They.
Have.
Today.
Whoa! Move on over there, Screech (RIP). We got a new nerd in town!
Screech was a good friend but he always was chasing after Lisa. RIP good buddy
One aspect that's always intrigued me, but would likely get me criticized pretty heavily on here is the possibility of a relegation model in High School football.
We classify schools just based on school size, but that's not the only determining factor in whether a school should be playing another school or not. A school might be large in enrollment size, but struggles heavily with low roster numbers, single-parent homes, poor administration, etc. and they face insurmountable struggles that will take decades to overcome. On the flip-side, a smaller school could have roster numbers consistently in the 70's and 80's, consistently win their district, and have an unbelievable community support system. What I'm saying is, it usually is deeper than "that school's big" or "that school's small."
I love to take a look at the 5-year "dynasty ratings" calpreps offers. They take into account strength of schedule as well as the 5-year cummulative rating of every school. What if we used a model like this to classify schools in Missouri? I think it's interesting to think about. Blair Oaks could be competing with the likes of Helias, Lamar could be competing amongst the bigger SWMO schools, and the lower-success large schools like Ritenour, Ruskin, etc. can get a chance to put together a solid season playing in smaller classifications like Class 3 or Class 2. I think the "districts" set forth by these relegated classifications should replace conferences, too. But that's another conversation. It's not an opportunity to give everyone a trophy per se, but to help accelerate the rebuilds of struggling programs and highlight the successes of smaller school dynasties.
We classify schools just based on school size, but that's not the only determining factor in whether a school should be playing another school or not. A school might be large in enrollment size, but struggles heavily with low roster numbers, single-parent homes, poor administration, etc. and they face insurmountable struggles that will take decades to overcome. On the flip-side, a smaller school could have roster numbers consistently in the 70's and 80's, consistently win their district, and have an unbelievable community support system. What I'm saying is, it usually is deeper than "that school's big" or "that school's small."
I love to take a look at the 5-year "dynasty ratings" calpreps offers. They take into account strength of schedule as well as the 5-year cummulative rating of every school. What if we used a model like this to classify schools in Missouri? I think it's interesting to think about. Blair Oaks could be competing with the likes of Helias, Lamar could be competing amongst the bigger SWMO schools, and the lower-success large schools like Ritenour, Ruskin, etc. can get a chance to put together a solid season playing in smaller classifications like Class 3 or Class 2. I think the "districts" set forth by these relegated classifications should replace conferences, too. But that's another conversation. It's not an opportunity to give everyone a trophy per se, but to help accelerate the rebuilds of struggling programs and highlight the successes of smaller school dynasties.
I don't see something like this ever getting traction here but Iowa is doing this or at least considering it. It's based on poverty (free/reduced lunch rates) which is what I think makes the most sense if you're going to do it because poverty definitely affects participation and participation (usually) affects outcome. I say usually because somehow Carthage manages in spite of having the highest poverty and lowest football participation in the COC. But the 3 other districts with high poverty round out the bottom 3 in terms of overall COC wins as a percent of enrollment.
I have ties to both Webb City and Carthage and the participation rates across many different activities is pretty staggering. In many instances WC will have roughly double the number of kids trying out for a given activity even though Carthage is larger by a decent margin. Carthage had slightly fewer kids on the roster than even Carl Junction in spite of having 500-600 more students overall.
I’ve googled the demographics of the COC schools , Carthage has a nearly 50% minority enrollment . Coach Guidie has done an amazing job . Neosho has about an 18 % Latino student population , they usually a few Latino players . The issue in Neosho is the Pacific Islanders , about 8 % of student enrollment , who don’t participate in anything
One of my dart players back in the day was from Micronesia. KC North has a good sized community he told me they have lots of relatives etc. in Neosho. Don't some of them wrestle?
Carthage definitely has unusual demographics. A ton of minorities. Kids that live crammed into a small house with 4 other families or move from house to house every other week. Kids who can't speak english or have educational backgrounds inconsistent with their age. Then you've also got some families with access to wealth that most people in this area can't even comprehend. Private jet kind of wealth. Or "we're going to donate the money for this baseball field because the ballot issue failed" kind of wealth. It's an interesting town, kind of like you take a normal town and just amplify both ends of the spectrum.
Over the years there has been a couple play football
This is the stuff I find to be extremely interesting - the different socioeconomic, demographic, unique struggles and opportunities that make up each school. I appreciate your post! I'm in Mid-Missouri, so my knowledge of SWMO is pretty limited.
I've been at schools where we get charter buses and Chick-fil-A for every game and I've been at schools where we don't even have a locker room. I can tell you all first-hand that tradition and socioeconomics matter so much more than the simple enrollment of a school. That's why I believe in having multiple sets of multipliers to determine classifications, and also just playing your district. A school like Blair Oaks or Helias is living in an entirely different world than a school like Warsaw or Riverview Gardens. Enrollment numbers just don't tell the entire story.
Definitely true. What I call the "country club sports" it is very noticeable. Baseball, Volleyball, Softball, Golf, etc. They didn't used to be country club sports, but to play competitively now growing up the parents will generally be dishing out $2000 at a minimum, and probably closer to $3-4k a year. Parents in Independence, Raytown or South KC as a large generalization don't have have that kind of money and you see it once they have to play the Blue Springs, Grain Valley, Liberty in high school.
If the Truman and Chrismans of the world are forced into C5 (or C6 maybe) with numbers that might be well under 50 total for the school by season's end, I think more about why don't they get to do the co-ops. Ruskin, Grandview, Belton, etc. I still think the perpetual losing keeps kids from going out for those sports, or they transfer after 8th grade.
