ADVERTISEMENT

Interesting take away on Pros and Cons of Transgender laws

bullitpdq68

Well-Known Member
Sep 22, 2005
13,232
5,360
113
Home of the Cubs!!
Cowherd and Neutron this is from Young Americans for Liberty, and even they while supporting the concept of equal bathroom accessibility approach it with sensibility that you too cannot see.

A breaking story from the San Jose Mercury News reports that earlier today, Gov. Jerry Brown signed into law AB-1266. This Bill amends the California Education code to allow transgendered students the right to use the bathroom and locker room facilities consistent with their identified gender, as well as the right to choose whether they want to participate in sports on a boys' or girls' team.

To put it simply, supporters (such as the ACLU) believe that the law will "reduce bullying and discrimination against transgender students," while opponents contend that the law is a violation of the privacy rights of other students.

I do not attempt to take on either of these camps — instead, here are some pros, cons and points to think on.

Pros:
1) This is a victory for transgendered students, who are now more able to live as their identified gender.

2) Transgendered students are likely to feel more accepted by society as a whole (even if that society is only the liberal sides of California) because of this law.

3) It forces the issue of equality into the spot light beyond just the same-sex marriage debate, and forces people to realize that there are many other areas in which people are treated differently because of who they are. (This point is based on the acceptance that transgendered individuals are "born in the wrong body," not that they simple "chose" to be the opposite sex.")

Cons:
1) While the ACLU and other supporters maintain that the law will decrease bullying against transgendered students, there is a distinct possibility that the opposite could be true — that targeting of transgendered students will increase. Students who are opposed to or do not understand trans-sexuality may feel threatened by a female-to-male or male-to-female student suddenly in their bathroom or locker room, and this could cause an outbreak of hate crimes across the state.

2) There is a fear that certain individuals will see this as an invite to "claim" transgendered status in order to be peeping toms in locker rooms. Furthermore, there are criticisms that male-to-female individuals, specifically, will have an unfair advantage in sports because they are still physically male (with higher testosterone levels, etc).

To both of these criticisms, an easy solution is to ensure that students claiming transgendered status are on transitional hormones; are actively working with a therapist to assist in their transition; has come out to family members and family members have spoken to the school, etc. Any of these could be used to at least ensure that the student is truly transitioning. Additionally, if the student is on hormones, that will effectively mitigate any physical advantage that a male-to-female student may have in sports.

However, and perhaps not surprisingly given politicians' general lack of foresight, the bill does not require any of these "control" factors. Now, it can be argued that no one would actually want to claim to be transgendered if they are not because of the social stigma, but it is still within the realm of possibility. The fact that the law doesnot account for this is a major flaw — it leaves serious gaps that can be exploited by persons looking to make a mockery of trans-sexuality. This is indeed the biggest con of all for the law.

Ultimately, it cannot be denied that this law is an attempted step towards further equality for the LGBT community. However, its lack of structure raises serious questions about how schools should proceed, and it is safe to say that there is still a long road ahead for this issue.

Content published on the Young Americans for Liberty blog is only representative of the opinions and research of the individual authors. It does not necessarily reflect the views, goals, or membership of YAL.
 
anigif_enhanced-buzz-24445-1370012304-6.gif
Nerdtron Moment "ITS A POLITICAL NON-STARTER...huh, cough eh, ugh....Translation this isn't a good opportunity to sneakbrag on this post, I can't prove the cure for cancer on this one.
 
Last edited:
is that all you got... For weeks you have called us bigots and Transgender haters and now a group that supports Transgender rights brings up the same points several of us have made and that is all you have.....
They don't really support transgender rights if they propose that

Schools should not be asking people for details of personal medical procedures before letting someone use the bathroom of their choice
 
They don't really support transgender rights if they propose that

Schools should not be asking people for details of personal medical procedures before letting someone use the bathroom of their choice

So basically you agree. I highlighted your key words you said people and not transgender.. and their choice, which basically means you agree anybody transgender or child molester under those laws can do as they please, there is no safe guard in place because as the laws are written it is anybodies choice for any reason... be it because they identify with a certain sex or they plan to molest.
 
Here is why we as conservatives are going to lose this battle... because we can't debate the issue without bringing up pedophiles.

I'm not saying that's not a legitimate concern, but the second we bring up pedophiles the argument shifts from the real topic. It's like when someone compares anyone to Hitler... debate over.

There is a way to explain the silliness without being labeled a bigot.

How can we legislate--or oppose legislation--based on a state of mind? You feel like a woman, so you are a woman... that's fine, but impossible to verify.

So here we are trying to grant people access into areas where they would've been traditionally not allowed. And you really can't use civil rights and white only bathrooms as an example because skin color is a pretty recognizable attribute.

So how is it regulated? Surely you're not saying that any boring straight man can use a ladies restroom. You might say that anyone who looks like a woman can use the ladies room even if they are biologically make. That's troublesome because transgender is no more about appearance than it is about genitalia... it's about a state of mind, a sense of being.

I feel like we get so caught up talking about bathrooms, and then pedophiles, and then ruining the debate, that we don't ever have the chance to get further into the topic. Bathrooms aren't that big of a deal. Build stalls, everybody poops, I really think folks would be adults about it. But now we have a precedent of folks being able to choose their gender, that choice being accepted, and then that person being recognized and treated as that gender without question.

The next step is locker rooms. Is really hard to extend bathroom rights without extending locker room rights. Feel like a girl, you belong in the girls locker room. And we can't judge that by appearance or behavior, it's purely a state of mind.

Sporting events? Is a person who pees in the ladies room and dresses in the girls locker room going to play on the boys basketball team? Probably not.

There are loans and grants made exclusively to women to promote women in business. If I'm transgender will I now qualify for these? I think we're headed in that direction.

Are there going to be more rapes if we allow transgender individuals to use the toilet of their choosing? I really don't think so. Some idiots will abuse the situation but they'll be dealt with appropriately. But are there serious consequences to extending equal rights to folks who claim transgender status? I really think so.
 
So basically you agree. I highlighted your key words you said people and not transgender.. and their choice, which basically means you agree anybody transgender or child molester under those laws can do as they please, there is no safe guard in place because as the laws are written it is anybodies choice for any reason... be it because they identify with a certain sex or they plan to molest.
not going to dignify this with an actual response. I am done here.
 
I'm sure the only thing that has been stopping men from raping women in the restroom has been their inability to get past the women's sign on the bathroom door.

Your inability to answer the question nm, I mean cow, answers the question.
 
So, kind of exactly like I said...

"Perverts and child molesters."

"Bigot..."

"CHILD MOLESTERS!"

...done.

There is more than one way to win this argument, and we keep driving down the same dead end road.
 
If this wasn't so pathetic it would be hilarious. Liberals rejecting simple science.
 
If you ask someone to explain something, doc will respond with an incoherent post.......just an FYI
as if you ever make any sense. Incoherent post is your excuse to me, cow, nm and others when you are baffled and don't know what to say. Which refers to 97.65% of your idiotic posts.:D
 
as if you ever make any sense. Incoherent post is your excuse to me, cow, nm and others when you are baffled and don't know what to say. Which refers to 97.65% of your idiotic posts.:D

I am never at a loss for words, or quest for knowledge.

You, on the other hand, show your disdain for wisdom with each post,...... Carry on
 
I wonder if transgenders are ok with portapots since they have to use them by themselves
 
Here is why we as conservatives are going to lose this battle... because we can't debate the issue without bringing up pedophiles.

I'm not saying that's not a legitimate concern, but the second we bring up pedophiles the argument shifts from the real topic. It's like when someone compares anyone to Hitler... debate over.

There is a way to explain the silliness without being labeled a bigot.

How can we legislate--or oppose legislation--based on a state of mind? You feel like a woman, so you are a woman... that's fine, but impossible to verify.

So here we are trying to grant people access into areas where they would've been traditionally not allowed. And you really can't use civil rights and white only bathrooms as an example because skin color is a pretty recognizable attribute.

So how is it regulated? Surely you're not saying that any boring straight man can use a ladies restroom. You might say that anyone who looks like a woman can use the ladies room even if they are biologically make. That's troublesome because transgender is no more about appearance than it is about genitalia... it's about a state of mind, a sense of being.

I feel like we get so caught up talking about bathrooms, and then pedophiles, and then ruining the debate, that we don't ever have the chance to get further into the topic. Bathrooms aren't that big of a deal. Build stalls, everybody poops, I really think folks would be adults about it. But now we have a precedent of folks being able to choose their gender, that choice being accepted, and then that person being recognized and treated as that gender without question.

The next step is locker rooms. Is really hard to extend bathroom rights without extending locker room rights. Feel like a girl, you belong in the girls locker room. And we can't judge that by appearance or behavior, it's purely a state of mind.

Sporting events? Is a person who pees in the ladies room and dresses in the girls locker room going to play on the boys basketball team? Probably not.

There are loans and grants made exclusively to women to promote women in business. If I'm transgender will I now qualify for these? I think we're headed in that direction.

Are there going to be more rapes if we allow transgender individuals to use the toilet of their choosing? I really don't think so. Some idiots will abuse the situation but they'll be dealt with appropriately. But are there serious consequences to extending equal rights to folks who claim transgender status? I really think so.
Conservatives should never argue on topics that have already been decided.
 
Last edited:
What's already been decided?

How many people are we even talking about?
Does anyone on this board actually know a tranny? I find the concept to be extremely creepy and unpleasant. Jenner is one sick dude. All of this publicity will lead to more screwballs using it as a way to gain attention.

A lot of time and energy has already been wasted on the subject. Luckily I have plenty to spare. :cool:
 
To me this argument is less about ladies with wieners and more about the precedent being set where society is granting privileges based on an unverifiable state of mind.
 
How many people are we even talking about?
Does anyone on this board actually know a tranny? I find the concept to be extremely creepy and unpleasant. Jenner is one sick dude. All of this publicity will lead to more screwballs using it as a way to gain attention.

A lot of time and energy has already been wasted on the subject. Luckily I have plenty to spare. :cool:
Can you imagine deciding your presidential vote on this topic? I sure can't.
 
Definitely wouldn't vote for our against someone based on this.

Even with disability benefits for mental reasons there has to be a medical recommendation, an approval process and waiting period. And it's such a complicated process that most people can't get benefits without hiring an attorney.
 
To me this argument is less about ladies with wieners and more about the precedent being set where society is granting privileges based on an unverifiable state of mind.

Well in fairness I think a lot of this argument is about ladies with wieners...

You do make a good point though.

If someone identifies as a transgendered, transracial climate scientist and they don't believe in man made climate change is that person crazy and why?
 
Definitely wouldn't vote for our against someone based on this.

Even with disability benefits for mental reasons there has to be a medical recommendation, an approval process and waiting period. And it's such a complicated process that most people can't get benefits without hiring an attorney.
I was being facetious
 
Reading back, that should've been obvious.

I'm horrible at reading into people's tones on here, and I don't have everybody figured out yet.
 
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT