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Anybody else still undecided or uneasy about who they are voting for in the upcoming election?

you have no proof that any countries numbers are bogus. You come on bro. You are just repeating gop twitter talking points. Per capita, compare the USA to Canada, Taiwan, South Korea, et etc etc. go ahead.

are you saying the gop ISNT hostile toward science? Absurd
They totally are. One of the things that drives me bonkers about the party is how they inject religion into everything, especially science and social agendas. But you really believe China had 50 cases a day back in April? Seriously? Did you need to see BigMac or Bonds stick a needle in their rump? Of course not. You believe the numbers put out by the Chinese government? And complain about the honesty of the president (valid) and the GOP (valid)? That's kinda funny when you think about it.
 
to me, it is all about morals and Trump has none. He calls people names, he is the most dishonest president we have ever had. I have always voted Republican until Trump he has ruined the once Proud Republican party but once he is removed the true Republican party will return. Biden for 4 years can't do much damage then a true conservative Republican will emerge. We had some very good choices in 2016 but we had to have Trump I voted for him hoping he would change I was wrong. I play golf in senior scrambles with a lot of older men they are all fed up with Trump.
 
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I don’t think that is true. My daughter is an RN at Mercy in Joplin and they are cutting back hours for lack of patients. Freeman came out with application statement a few weeks ago saying their Covid patient count has gone down every week since july

My Dad was in the Covid unit at Freemans in Joplin, and because he only needed oxygen they released him early to open up a bed, this was just a few weeks ago and he said it was pretty full up there. He was still positive so we had to drop off his vehicle so he could drive himself home.

But yes you are right there are other parts of hospitals that are suffering and cutting hours and even laying off. My Sister is an RN and she says they are giving Nurses and doctors two options at her hospital. You can work the Covid unit or get your hours cut back, because they just don't need anybody in the other areas right now, because they have cut back on elective surgeries and people just are not going in. Even the ER numbers are way down right now. Another one of my sisters works at a local ER and says their numbers of none Covid ER visits is way down.

This was just a few weeks ago numbers have increased since then.

 
The Asian countries, especially Japan, but all of them, have been thru these pandemics in recent years are incredibly disciplined when it comes to mask wearing, isolating the infected, trusting science and fearing the repercussions if they endanger their fellow citizens. They ain’t like us. The selfishness and stupidity here is off the rails. I saw that Sunday at the Desloge Walmart. Trump wearing a mask and asking others to do so would have called upon people’s patriotism to take precautions. He did the opposite. It has nothing to do with “hating Trump”.

My mom has told me of all the things that were rationed during WWII, including having to have coupons to buy gas. People sacrificed for the greater good. Trump said “follow the guidelines” one minute and then ridiculed people for wearing a mask.
I'm not defending his actions. I just think is insanely laughable you think China's numbers were/are accurate. The mask wearing in those places has far more to do with air quality and not the spread of a virus. They're two completely different things. But I agree, countries that you have mentioned to have a far greater control over their citizens. Probably in large part because they live in constant fear of their governments.
 
I'm not defending his actions. I just think is insanely laughable you think China's numbers were/are accurate. The mask wearing in those places has far more to do with air quality and not the spread of a virus. They're two completely different things. But I agree, countries that you have mentioned to have a far greater control over their citizens. Probably in large part because they live in constant fear of their governments.
Talk about fear, elect trump for another 4 years and you will live in constant fear of your government.
 
Talk about fear, elect trump for another 4 years and you will live in constant fear of your government.
I don't, at all. I'm not a supporter, or a MAGA guy. But I also have zero fear of the government. And I wouldn't if Biden were elected, then found unfit and either Harris or Pelosi were to become president. Which, btw, I think will happen. I'm a rational thinking person. No matter the hysteria going on, the government isn't the group to be fearful of. It's the radicals on both sides that concern me, but I trust the government will contain it enough to keep the citizens of the country safe.
 
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I don't, at all. I'm not a supporter, or a MAGA guy. But I also have zero fear of the government. And I wouldn't if Biden were elected, then found unfit and either Harris or Pelosi were to become president. Which, btw, I think will happen. I'm a rational thinking person. No matter the hysteria going on, the government isn't the group to be fearful of. It's the radicals on both sides that concern me, but I trust the government will contain it enough to keep the citizens of the country safe.
I can't believe there are people who believe they can take on the government. I am just shocked that people think they are going to kidnap governors and start civil wars. They think they can take on B-52's, and tanks, and drones. These people are absolutely psycho, and we have several who need to be institutions.
 
I don't, at all. I'm not a supporter, or a MAGA guy. But I also have zero fear of the government. And I wouldn't if Biden were elected, then found unfit and either Harris or Pelosi were to become president. Which, btw, I think will happen. I'm a rational thinking person. No matter the hysteria going on, the government isn't the group to be fearful of. It's the radicals on both sides that concern me, but I trust the government will contain it enough to keep the citizens of the country safe.
Eagle Ball, Do you think the 77 year old Biden has a better chance of a long life then the 74 year old Trump. Trump is 40 pounds overweight and recovering from Covid-19 and hated by people all over the world. Biden does not have a weigh problem and appears to be in good Health. If Trump goes down, we then have the " Fly" taking over. The question is who would you rather have running the government, The Fly or Harris?

I believe Biden can make it for two terms ( Eight Years ) with 12 doctors and a helicopter @ his disposal , if needed.

Do we have anyone opposing the Fly taking over and making decisions if the overweight Trump does not recover from Covid-19?
 
you trump supporters think Trump cares about any of you. He is a narcist and they don't have the ability to care. Bush Administration was 100 times better than trump's administration. We are the laughing stock of the world. And our allies are looking elsewhere for support.
 
Is a narcist kind of like a drug informant?
It's always a joy to read your 9th grade contribution to the message board. Just stay on the football board and show your lack of common knowledge. There is 10,000 clowns out of a job and you try to be funny.
 
Biden is in good enough health to live another 10-15 years. Former presidents get the best care and are living longer.
 
Hopefully Mayor Pete B. will garner a cabinet post and be the Dem nominee in 2024.
Would’ve voted for him this time. And can’t imagine not voting for him in 2024. Still have no idea why he’s not the nominee. I totally dig guys like him. His stances on policies follow no party lines. And as a young gay man, he could run with the far left...instead he’s got an intelligent approach to each position. He could sleep with horses for all I care.
 
For the 1,000th time, trump's initial ban was only on Chinese nationals. 40,000 people from US and other countries entered the US before all flights from Asia were banned.
What should have happened then? I’m genuinely curious at how you think it could’ve been stopped. I’m simple. I’d just say shut them all down. But that’s not really possible.
 
Biden is not healthy. He has had brain surgery twice. I don't know what will happen to him in the next 4 years, let alone 8 and I am not about to presume he will survive the next 4. I am ok voting for him because I am ok with Harris. She wasn't my first choice, but I would rather have her than Trump or Pence, or even Pelosi.
 
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Trump is mentally fit????? Not hardly!!
See, this is what I love. Never said a word about him being mentally fit. I think he's nutty as a fruitcake. But the comment was about Biden's ability given the doctors and care available. The two topics, as crazy as it sounds, are unilateral.
 
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Biden is not healthy. He has had brain surgery twice. I don't know what will happen to him in the next 4 years, let alone 8 and I am not about to presume he will survive the next 4. I am ok voting for him because I am ok with Harris. She wasn't my first choice, but I would rather have her than Trump or Pence, or even Pelosi.
This is where it gets interesting to me. Because you basically have to rank all that you mentioned. For me, Pence is easily at the top. I hate his religious stance on social issues, but other than that I'm okay. Not fired up, just okay. I can't stand how Harris seemingly flip-flops on issues when challenged. She's a little too Bernie for me. Far too flimsy with tax-payer money. But, she'd rank second. After that, I just don't care. There's not really a winner.
 
I can’t think of any republican in Congress who believes in science. Can you list one who will admit we need to deal with climate change?
Romney? He's got to be about as close as there is. That's my problem with the whole two party crap. Herd thinking has overwhelmed both sides, and nobody seems to be a centrist. Biden was, pre-Obama. Hell, that was the entire reason Biden was his VP choice. An old white guy that could pull votes from both sides that were undecided.

Romney and Buttigieg define the politician I love. They have their personal beliefs, but you can see the obvious separation from those beliefs and in doing what they think is for the greater good. It's a lost art in today's society.
 
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Romney? He's got to be about as close as there is. That's my problem with the whole two party crap. Herd thinking has overwhelmed both sides, and nobody seems to be a centrist. Biden was, pre-Obama. Hell, that was the entire reason Biden was his VP choice. An old white guy that could pull votes from both sides that were undecided.

Romney and Buttigieg define the politician I love. They have their personal beliefs, but you can see the obvious separation from those beliefs and in doing what they think is for the greater good. It's a lost art in today's society.
Well said!
 
What is a centrist? Can a centrist think lowering the age for Medicare is a good thing? Or offering a buy in to Medicare? Can a centrist believe we should have a plan to gradually get off of fossil fuel and make moves to save the planet? Can a centrist believe that billionaires and large corporations not paying squat in taxes but using our infrastructure is an unjust system? Are those radical concepts? Or are they centrist?
Unless you have a source for Dilithium Crystals on this side of the galaxy we will never get off of fossil fuels it is impossible
 
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Unless you have a source for Dilithium Crystals on this side of the galaxy we will never get off of fossil fuels it is impossible
Angeleyes74 = Stop n Go = Outsideveer89 you sure are playing it softly I guess you are running out available names to use. Hope they don't catch you......NOT
 
Now there is some forward scientific thinking.
Well renewable energy sources right now produce 11% of the energy we consume in the United States. Of that 11% total 55% of it is hydroelectric with only 45% coming from wind and solar. So basically right now about 5% of our energy comes from wind and solar.

Wind and solar are not dependable sources of power. What are we going to do if the majority of our power comes from wind and solar when it’s nighttime in January and the winds not blowing and we have no power??
 
So you are saying we don't have people smart enough to make renewable energy sources work? I am glad there is an unlimited supply of oil and gas.
 
So you are saying we don't have people smart enough to make renewable energy sources work? I am glad there is an unlimited supply of oil and gas.
My home is basically off grid, the only thing I use utility power for is my air conditioner during summer months.

Rest of my power comes from Solar panels with three 80 amp charge controllers and six very large 4 volt batteries to store energy and power my home when the sun isn’t shining. I live with renewable energy every day.

It’s a fact that solar panels don’t work when the sun isn’t shining.
And it’s a fact wind turbines don’t work when the wind isn’t blowing. And it’s s fact that unless we build a battery the size of Texas to store energy we will never have much more renewable energy than we have today.

If someone can explain how we can make solar and wind as dependable as a coal or gas fired power plant I will gladly listen
 
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You're limiting our scientific knowledge to what we can do today if we don't explore alternatives. A century ago, going to the moon seemed impossible.
 
My home is basically off grid, the only thing I use utility power for is my air conditioner during summer months.

Rest of my power comes from Solar panels with three 80 amp charge controllers and six very large 4 volt batteries to store energy and power my home when the sun isn’t shining. I live with renewable energy every day.

It’s a fact that solar panels don’t work when the sun isn’t shining.
And it’s a fact wind turbines don’t work when the wind isn’t blowing. And it’s s fact that unless we build a battery the size of Texas to store energy we will never have much more renewable energy than we have today.

If someone can explain how we can make solar and wind as dependable as a coal or gas fired power plant I will gladly listen
Solar panels!!! Same MO as Blondie=outsideveer89.
 
Can't believe I'm over here, and there are so many things said in this thread I want to respond to...but I'll just throw out a few thoughts that may help the original poster decide.

1. Trump's "travel ban" didn't really do anything.... 30,000+ people still entered the US from China during that period. So if you take that away.... what exactly did he do to reduce the spread of covid? Hospitalizations and deaths are creeping back up rapidly too.
https://apnews.com/article/d227b34b168e576bf5068b92a03c003d

2. Joe Biden is as centrist as it gets. I won't say who I supported during the dem primary, but let me say he/she was wayyyyyy further left than Joe. Kamala isn't even that liberal either! The reason Joe is polling ahead by historical numbers is because, outside of Trump acting like a buffoon, their campaign plan almost seems like it was made for Bernie!

3. Republicans ARE actively trying to get rid of the ACA. They've put it in front of the court 70 times. Republicans do not support the expansive coverage of pre-existing conditions because it prevents insurance companies from making more money. Of course they can't come out and say "we're taking away coverage from pre-existing conditions" because it would RUIN their chance at any election. So instead they just blatantly lie because they have no other response. I find our healthcare absurd. Republicans act like the ACA (don't dare call it Obamacare) is some liberal creation. Dude, the ACA is ultra-conservative compared to what most countries have and enjoy.

4. It just comes down to your beliefs. I hate how partisan/polarized everything has become. Most people are well-meaning. At the end of the day, how comfortable do you feel having Trump be our leader? Our nation is as separated as ever and it is directly because of his buffoonery. He doesn't care about any of us. Outside of that, if you are strictly pro-life and pleased with how many conservative judges Trump has appointed, then I fully understand a vote for him. I do. Outside of that.... I just don't know. I promise you that Joe will not take away your guns, Cory Booker won't rip up your suburbs, a mob won't knock on your door November 4th, and no churches will be closed (all accusations Trump is making every day). Let's get back to decency, please.

PS - Joe will 100% be a one-term president. He'll step aside and Kamala will run in 2024. I would not be surprised if she faces a more progressive challenger in the primary, though, like AOC, Warren, or Katie Porter.

Country is divided because we are becoming a Leftist socialist regime, with the Vile irresponsible and lazy grifting off the Hard work of others....Hence wanting Free healthcare...not a Human right nothing more than a benefit that should be paid for or not received by any stretch of the measure. Pre-existing conditions should warrant higher rates or self pay. Simple as that. I'm not my neighbors keeper and I shouldn't have to pay for his infirmity.

Joe could only be considered a centrist by a True Red Flag waving commie. NO other way to look at it.

Joe would Clearly take away AR-15 the most popular gun in America and a Constitutional Right to own.

Churches have already been closed....Suburbs have been attacked and the Mob has came Knocking to peoples houses.

All easy google Searches, I can post links if necessary..... and Biden and Harris have 100% supported it and even supported the bailing out the Rioting thugs.

But nice Spin and Propaganda...
 
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So you are saying we don't have people smart enough to make renewable energy sources work? I am glad there is an unlimited supply of oil and gas.

A lot of the problem is a physics issue......We would need a Massive Giant leap in technology to move away from Fossil Fuels....unless Nuclear is palatable to the masses. We are stuck with Fossil Fuel for the next 100 years at least maybe more.
 
You're limiting our scientific knowledge to what we can do today if we don't explore alternatives. A century ago, going to the moon seemed impossible.

Nobody says stop searching or doing research....but we have to be realistic and see that probably in our Lifetimes and even our children's lifetimes we are going to be using Fossil Fuels to live. Nobody has more incentive to develop a cheaper and more reliable energy source than the Big Energy companies today. If they do that they'd make even More cash.
 
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Country is divided because we are becoming a Leftist socialist regime, with the Vile irresponsible and lazy grifting off the Hard work of others....Hence wanting Free healthcare...not a Human right nothing more than a benefit that should be paid for or not received by any stretch of the measure. Pre-existing conditions should warrant higher rates or self pay. Simple as that. I'm not my neighbors keeper and I shouldn't have to pay for his infirmity.

Joe could only be considered a centrist by a True Red Flag waving commie. NO other way to look at it.

Joe would Clearly take away AR-15 the most popular gun in America and a Constitutional Right to own.

Churches have already been closed....Suburbs have been attacked and the Mob has came Knocking to peoples houses.

All easy google Searches, I can post links if necessary..... and Biden and Harris have 100% supported it and even supported the bailing out the Rioting thugs.

But nice Spin and Propaganda...

Our country is so divided because of the tribalism being preached by our politicians. I don't support 100% of either party's platform. Some good ideas and bad ideas on both sides.

It's a myth that all people on welfare are Dems. Look at states like TN where some areas are heavily Rep and have some of the highest rates of welfare recipients in the country.

Insurance companies continue to have record profits as rates continue to go up. The biggest scam going in America. I hope none of your grandchildren are born with extreme physical infirmary. A preexisting disease like the need for a kidney transplant for a child will take a lifetime for the family to pay off without adequate coverage.

The great majority of Americans favor a ban on assault guns. Begin your "They want to take our guns away" nonsense.

If churches are closing, it's because of money. And one instance of protesters knocking down a gate in an exclusive subdivision and now our suburbs are under attack. Pure propaganda.

We hear the some scary dialogue every elections about how the Dems will turn our country into a socialist/communist state, and when a Dem is in the White House it doesn't happen. Same ol' song and dance from the Rep to instill fear.
 
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Can't believe I'm over here, and there are so many things said in this thread I want to respond to...but I'll just throw out a few thoughts that may help the original poster decide.

1. Trump's "travel ban" didn't really do anything.... 30,000+ people still entered the US from China during that period. So if you take that away.... what exactly did he do to reduce the spread of covid? Hospitalizations and deaths are creeping back up rapidly too.
https://apnews.com/article/d227b34b168e576bf5068b92a03c003d

2. Joe Biden is as centrist as it gets. I won't say who I supported during the dem primary, but let me say he/she was wayyyyyy further left than Joe. Kamala isn't even that liberal either! The reason Joe is polling ahead by historical numbers is because, outside of Trump acting like a buffoon, their campaign plan almost seems like it was made for Bernie!..He was, he isn't anymore. And if Harris isn't considered extremely left, it's because she flip-flops on issues when pinned down on them. It's why her campaign tanked. Joe prior to being Veep and prior to whatever is going on with his mental state, he'd get my vote in a second. Now, I'm worried my vote for him goes to the left agenda quickly. Just as I hate how a vote for Trump supports the right. At least with a vote for Trump, I think he's the president four years after winning. There's no way that's the case with Biden. And that’s the problem with a vote for Biden. You get Harris’s complete unknowns, or the influence of the left.

3. Republicans ARE actively trying to get rid of the ACA. They've put it in front of the court 70 times. Republicans do not support the expansive coverage of pre-existing conditions because it prevents insurance companies from making more money. Of course they can't come out and say "we're taking away coverage from pre-existing conditions" because it would RUIN their chance at any election. So instead they just blatantly lie because they have no other response. I find our healthcare absurd. Republicans act like the ACA (don't dare call it Obamacare) is some liberal creation. Dude, the ACA is ultra-conservative compared to what most countries have and enjoy...I wish they would do away with it, to an extent. I should be able to choose my insurance, or choose not to have any, without the worry of a fine at year end (yes, I know Trump changed that). When I go to my one year olds wellness exam, there shouldn’t be a cash price and a insured price. The problem isn’t insurance for the consumer, it’s the health-care magnates and insurance companies. The largest problem with ACA is it isn't affordable at all. Legitimizing programs like medicare and medicaid would be much more valuable. I'm a teacher. My wife and I considered her staying at home (she's a bank manager) with our daughter when she was born. Because I'm a teacher, we had these options for insurance...1. $800ish/month for ACA plan that had about a $12,000 deductible. 2. $800ish/month through my school plan (pretty typical for public schools to be that high for dependents). 3. Paying roughly a $2000 fine for not having insurance. 4. $400/month health sharing plan that meets ACA. If it weren't for ACA, we just would've paid cash for everything needed. And we would've carried some sort of catastrophic health insurance for both. And would've spent far less. ACA absolutely kills people like me, a middle-class worker that strives to make more. Health-care needs some serious reform. Mandating health insurance isn't part of that. The models you speak of in other countries aren't applicable here. We're the third largest country in the world. You can't build a model for 350M people like you can with 20M people. It's not feasible.

4. It just comes down to your beliefs. I hate how partisan/polarized everything has become. Most people are well-meaning. At the end of the day, how comfortable do you feel having Trump be our leader? Our nation is as separated as ever and it is directly because of his buffoonery. He doesn't care about any of us. Outside of that, if you are strictly pro-life and pleased with how many conservative judges Trump has appointed, then I fully understand a vote for him. I do. Outside of that.... I just don't know. I promise you that Joe will not take away your guns, Cory Booker won't rip up your suburbs, a mob won't knock on your door November 4th, and no churches will be closed (all accusations Trump is making every day). Let's get back to decency, please...Couldn't agree more. The herd mentality and divide is just nuts, with both parties. I don't get it, at all.

PS - Joe will 100% be a one-term president. He'll step aside and Kamala will run in 2024. I would not be surprised if she faces a more progressive challenger in the primary, though, like AOC, Warren, or Katie Porter...I wish I could get behind believing he'd make it even half of a term. Btw, you misspelled Pete Buttigieg there at the end. Come on...Why can't the party get behind him? The people in this country that give a crap that he's gay aren't voting for a Dem anyway. So dumb. Dude would be great.
 
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