Remind me why we changed playoff system
- Thread starter kaching
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MSHSAA wanted a point system which required everyone to use Common Core math.
They wanted a system where A LOT more teams (coaches) could point to success for winning a "playoff game." Its like expanding the NCAA basketball tournament to 256 teams...well, make that ALL teams in this case.
That's probably the ironic truth here ... it was changed so the 7s and 8s got to play and now we're trying to figure out how to keep the 7s and 8s from getting mauled! ........ in FOOTBALL. 
That's probably the ironic truth here ... it was changed so the 7s and 8s got to play and now we're trying to figure out how to keep the 7s and 8s from getting mauled! ........ in FOOTBALL.
Well, get mauled year after year, then have a year you end up at 4,5,6 and get a win. THEN, its a big deal. "The year we won a playoff game."
West Plains came to Webb City as an eight seed a few years back. Maybe Ary's first or second season. They got beat pretty bad but it didn't seem to stunt their growth as a program or beat the kids up too bad they didn't want to return.
This is a thing I've never understood. The whole "playoff" semantic debate. Districts are districts. The winner of districts qualifies for the state playoff system. But all teams have a chance in the playoffs, through district tournaments. It just absolutely boggles my mind football guys can't seem to get this. Ever.
The playoffs, play-offs, postseason and/or finals of a sports league are a competition played after the regular season by the top competitors to determine the league champion or a similar accolade. Depending on the league, the playoffs may be either a single game, a series of games, or a tournament, and may use a single-elimination system or one of several other different playoff formats.
Ok...So what's the point? Why is football the only friggn' sport that gets hung up on this whole district thing? Seriously. Literally the only sport. If a coach says, "hey, we won a playoff game"...just roll your eyes and golf clap I guess. But honestly, football IS THE ONLY SPORT where this seems to be a thing. Baffling.
1) post regular season scheduled game. + 2) Lose and you are out = "playoff"
Why it changed:
1) Conferences and rivalries are important. This was conflicted in the old 7/3 model.
2) Allowing 2 teams out of each district into the state playoffs was silly
3) Football being the same as the other sports
My only tweak would go to 16 districts with 4 teams each. Then the state playoff tournament would begin with the district winners in sectionals. Cut down on some drive time.
1) Conferences and rivalries are important. This was conflicted in the old 7/3 model.
2) Allowing 2 teams out of each district into the state playoffs was silly
3) Football being the same as the other sports
My only tweak would go to 16 districts with 4 teams each. Then the state playoff tournament would begin with the district winners in sectionals. Cut down on some drive time.
JN do you consider basketball district tournaments the state playoffs? I mean it's literally the exact same system. Call it whatever you like, but they are exactly the same. I think it's a great system. The amount of bitching about 8s losing big, or this and that. Who cares.
I never used the term "state playoffs." Simply, "playoffs." It is a playoff if it is 1) post regular season and 2) lose and you go home.
I gotcha but they way you seemed to pounce on the guy made it seemed like you disagreed with him. I like to think that we have a district tournament that qualifies you for the state playoff.
Maybe people would be happier if we all agreed to say that 8 district champions make the state playoffs.
It's worth noting that Willard edged out Waynesville for the number 2 seed in their district by six hundredths of a point to earn home field advantage in the district semifinals. 5 of their games were decided by 12 points of fewer. A missed extra point or a decision to go for the PAT instead of 2 against Nixa would have cost them the 2 seed. With the current playoff system, every regular season game matters not just the final 3.
Why do there necessarily have to be 8 districts in each class anyway? Ozark had to travel a long way to Eureka to lose by a lot, but it's not like that trip is going to bankrupt a Class 6 football program. It creates a bigger burden on smaller schools though. Large schools outside of Kansas City and Saint Louis are going to have to travel a bit anyway. Keep the points system, but change the district allocation in each class:
Class 1: 64 teams (16 districts of 4)
Class 2: 64 teams (16 districts of 4)
Class 3: 56 teams (8 districts of 7, top seed gets bye)
Class 4: 56 teams (4 districts of 14, top 2 seeds get bye)
Class 5: 56 teams (2 districts of 28, top 4 seeds get bye)
Class 6: 34 teams (1 district, catch all)
Class 1: 64 teams (16 districts of 4)
Class 2: 64 teams (16 districts of 4)
Class 3: 56 teams (8 districts of 7, top seed gets bye)
Class 4: 56 teams (4 districts of 14, top 2 seeds get bye)
Class 5: 56 teams (2 districts of 28, top 4 seeds get bye)
Class 6: 34 teams (1 district, catch all)
Shouldnt you be preparing practice plans for the hardwood or something? Round ballers ripping on football people is all we need.
Next, you will be saying it makes sense to take two weeks off before a playoff game....
So what is the problem then? I get what you're saying, but call it absolutely whatever you want. Where I get lost is...What's the problem? Other than the 1v8 stuff.
First time in 18 yrs not coaching hoops Ducky! Baseball is over. College hoops hasn't started yet. Other than the fantasy team I just inherited, I'm fully committed to spewing hot takes daily!
I get that's not exactly ideal...but it does prevent the 1v8 stuff, which isn't really ideal. Truthfully though, I side with you on the forfeits. Shouldn't really hold it against them for not wanting to play. Protecting kids that are at a great disadvantage in a physical sport like football is never a bad thing.
Here is the thing with the 1 vs 8 deal. In other sports, the ace pitcher might mow you down or the best shooter might hurt your feelings by draining threes all night. But in football your "players" might be hurt, not your feelings.
There is a reason you are an 8 seed. Maybe that 300 pound left tackle got an ACL week three and with football participation down 15.5% in the state, your replacement is a 175 pounder who is a fighter but cant handle D-ends 75 pounds larger. Next thing you know your QB, you had hoped to be your point guard on the hardwood is getting pounded into submission and can barely walk off the field on his own.
I think we agree on this.
Totally agreed. Just playing the devil's advocate role here...Don't those matchups happen during the regular season too? Is it too much to leave it up to the schools if they don't want to play? Legit questions.
Here’s a thought.
Some of these 8 seed that are getting pounded, in the current district format, we’re getting pounded weeks 8,9,10 in the old format. So not only was there one time where poor Jimmy could barely walk off the field but there was 3.
This format gives them an option to Trade out: possibly 3 beatdowns, for a week 8,9 schedule of their choice and one unholy beat down at the end
Some of these 8 seed that are getting pounded, in the current district format, we’re getting pounded weeks 8,9,10 in the old format. So not only was there one time where poor Jimmy could barely walk off the field but there was 3.
This format gives them an option to Trade out: possibly 3 beatdowns, for a week 8,9 schedule of their choice and one unholy beat down at the end
False. The old 3-school round robin format was changed because some schools failed to win their district, thereby missing the playoffs. As I recall, Rock Bridge really raised a hissy fit one year because they finished 9-1, and considered themselves one of the top 3-4 teams in the state, but were unlucky enough to fall in a district that also had one of those teams. They lost, missed the "playoffs", and didn't even win their district. Their argument went like this: "how can one of the top 3 teams in the state not even qualify for the playoffs?" Several schools also griped about fairness when they fell into competitive districts, so we had to change the whole system.That's probably the ironic truth here ... it was changed so the 7s and 8s got to play and now we're trying to figure out how to keep the 7s and 8s from getting mauled! ........ in FOOTBALL.
Now, of course, it's still the same. You may still find yourself in a competitive district where 2-3 schools are all capable of a title-game run, so the new system really fixed nothing.
One of the benefits of the old round robin districts was that each district winner at least beat out 3 other teams to get there, so you didn't see such a huge disparity in the playoffs (every team was already a district winner).
The current system is by far the fairest and best system that has ever been hatched out of COMO. In reality most years their are less than 3 or 4 teams that have a legitimate chance at winning a title in each class some years in some classes less than that.
OK. Here's a really bad playoff system. A team wins a state championship in the largest class. The next year, they go undefeated in the regular season but can't defend their title because they didn't qualify for the playoffs because of the points system.
I prefer the 4 team districts with twice as many teams winning a title. Two teams in each district get to finish the regular season with a W. That makes for a pleasant finish to your season. And dont tell me winning a football game is a participation trophy. Its preparing your butt off and playing like a man no matter the situation.
I know in Arizona they pretty much use the calpreps ratings and the top 16 in the ratings make the playoffs, and you can make it with a losing record. Three games during the season they play teams outside of their region from the same class to weight it out.
The chances of the 8th best team and the #1 best team being in the same 4 team district are much less than the 100% chance we have now.
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