COC Week #2...Let's discuss

[Eagles_Ball]

There's no pickems...but we can discuss...or you can pickem if you want. I just miss the banter on the weeks games.

Week 2 games
CJ @ Webb
REPMO @ Ozark (Thursday game)
Willard @ Joplin (Thursday game)
Carthage @ Branson
Neosho @ Nixa

Week 1 results
Willard 28 Neosho 21
Joplin 35 Branson 14
Nixa 14 Webb 7
Ozark 42 CJ 21
REPMO 20 Carthage 14

Webb beats CJ...probably pretty soundly.

REPMO beats Ozark...I'd say this is the game of the week. Or at least the "close" game of the week. Ozark is better. Their result at CJ was probably the biggest surprise in week 1. How much better? Should find that out Thursday night. It's a reasonable measuring stick for the middle part of the conference.

It'll be a quick 4th quarter Thursday night in Joplin.

Carthage gets the win, but think it could be close. This is a good one to tell us just how average Carthage is going to be and if and how much improved Branson is.

Woof...Coyotes in Nixa will be packed with postgame football crowd by 9pm at the latest.

 

[sw5890]

Ozark was the biggest surprise for me too. I thought Neosho would beat Willard but it was close. I expected Carthage to lose possibly by 2+ scores but the fact that they nearly came back to win gives me some optimism for them. Like Webb they left multiple TDs on the field after getting in a position to score. I watched a decent amount of Webb game and I thought they looked pretty great all things considered. They will easily beat everyone else and will give Joplin a tough time too. Republic, for a hyped-up senior heavy team still has some work to do IMO.

Looking to friday:

Webb City will show their stuff against a smaller school vs a larger school. Probably run away with it early.

Nixa and Joplin will both win handily.

Republic will beat Ozark I think but maybe Ozark is this years surprise (I originally thought it could be Neosho).

Ordinarily I would look past Branson and Carthage. I think Carthage is ready to make a statement but Branson may not rollover. I think Carthage will win but it won't be the blowout they've enjoyed in recent years. If the game is close I am not sure what it will indicate. Is Carthage very average or is Branson a lot better?

 

[hitch_and_go]

Did anybody watch the CJ game ? I figured they would beat Ozark with 16 returning starters coming back . Is CJ bad again or is Ozark much improved?

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Did anybody watch the CJ game ? I figured they would beat Ozark with 16 returning starters coming back . Is CJ bad again or is Ozark much improved?

I think both are true, to an extent. I'm not sure CJ is very good at all. They're extremely one dimensional on offense. Their offense didn't get much done except for three big chunk plays on offense. Ozark was only up 20-14 late in 3rd (thank AC100) when they scored on a pick 6 deep in CJ territory. It got pretty ugly from there. But honestly, even when Ozark was up 20-14, the eye test said they were the better team. I think Ozark's game with REPMO this week will go a long way in gauging just how much better they are. Are they more the best of the bottom or safely in the middle?

 

[AC100]

CJ can't throw the ball. Therefore the other team puts 10 guys at the LOS. CJ can't move the ball so the D is on the field most of the game and are gassed by the 4th quarter. Sad because it is a pretty good D for 3 quarters.

 

[AC100]

Just something interesting I heard. The CJ play by play guy is also President of the school board. He said something Friday night along the lines of the COC may not be the best fit for CJ.

 

[COCfan1212]

Ozark was the biggest surprise for me too. I thought Neosho would beat Willard but it was close. I expected Carthage to lose possibly by 2+ scores but the fact that they nearly came back to win gives me some optimism for them. Like Webb they left multiple TDs on the field after getting in a position to score. I watched a decent amount of Webb game and I thought they looked pretty great all things considered. They will easily beat everyone else and will give Joplin a tough time too. Republic, for a hyped-up senior heavy team still has some work to do IMO.

Looking to friday:

Webb City will show their stuff against a smaller school vs a larger school. Probably run away with it early.

Nixa and Joplin will both win handily.

Republic will beat Ozark I think but maybe Ozark is this years surprise (I originally thought it could be Neosho).

Ordinarily I would look past Branson and Carthage. I think Carthage is ready to make a statement but Branson may not rollover. I think Carthage will win but it won't be the blowout they've enjoyed in recent years. If the game is close I am not sure what it will indicate. Is Carthage very average or is Branson a lot better?

Neosho and Willard has been a fun little rivalry the past few years. This game took forever and was still in the third quarter as most games were wrapping up. Willard is quite a bit improved from the past couple of years, especially on defense. They needed to win last week in order to have the season they are hoping for, and they got it done. They seem to have some of the size once again that Willard has been so well known for in the past. Neosho couldnt do a thing on offense in the first half. Had some dropped passes that hurt. They miss Siler and Green in a big way. QB still throws a nice ball but didn't seem nearly as explosive as they did last year.

 

[Pleiku]

I think both are true, to an extent. I'm not sure CJ is very good at all. They're extremely one dimensional on offense. Their offense didn't get much done except for three big chunk plays on offense. Ozark was only up 20-14 late in 3rd (thank AC100) when they scored on a pick 6 deep in CJ territory. It got pretty ugly from there. But honestly, even when Ozark was up 20-14, the eye test said they were the better team. I think Ozark's game with REPMO this week will go a long way in gauging just how much better they are. Are they more the best of the bottom or safely in the middle?

I think Ozarks freshmen team went undefeated a couple years ago , those players would now be varsity

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Just something interesting I heard. The CJ play by play guy is also President of the school board. He said something Friday night along the lines of the COC may not be the best fit for CJ.

I feel like everyone that knows anything about the COC knows this. I really, really hope something happens soon where the Greene/Christian county schools can get together and form a conference. It makes far too much sense though, so it'll never happen. Economy is out of control, kids spending a ton of time on busses, don't have drivers, price of fuel...the list of reasons why is super long...the why not list basically reads like middle school drama on a message board...so and so doesn't like this guy, I'll never be in a conference with them...that sort of thing.

 

[Stimie69er]

If Ozark beats Republic.. that will be they spark they needed.

 

[bullitpdq68]

Just something interesting I heard. The CJ play by play guy is also President of the school board. He said something Friday night along the lines of the COC may not be the best fit for CJ.

LOL, we have been hearing this for awhile now from many in CJ. There are many who feel leaving the Big 8 was a huge mistake. Does playing larger schools help sure it can but it can also get you beat up and dishearten your kids from even going out. The COC fits them in a few sports but football is the big one and when they left they were thinking they were king of the world but not quite there now.
To top it off Wall thru gasoline on the bridge as CJ left by insulting every Big 8 school and their facilities by saying how bad they sucked and how much better CJ was compared to them. So There's not a big 8 school that would vote to allow CJ back in again right now, wounds still to raw.

 

[AC100]

The OC would be a better fit athletically but the travel is too much.

 

[AC100]

I feel like everyone that knows anything about the COC knows this. I really, really hope something happens soon where the Greene/Christian county schools can get together and form a conference. It makes far too much sense though, so it'll never happen. Economy is out of control, kids spending a ton of time on busses, don't have drivers, price of fuel...the list of reasons why is super long...the why not list basically reads like middle school drama on a message board...so and so doesn't like this guy, I'll never be in a conference with them...that sort of thing.

At least 3 of the Springfield schools probably don't want anything to do with the suburban schools.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

The OC would be a better fit athletically but the travel is too much.

My dream...

• Nixa
• Ozark
• Republic
• Willard
• Kickapoo
• Glendale
• Parkview
• Central

SPS can decide if they want to add Hillcrest or not. All the outliers can figure it out on their own. It sounds harsh, but man...it's so dumb and antiquated to keep on with this the way it is. That's what, a 30 mile radius. Think of the time, money, and resources saved. Yeah, just makes way too much sense though. And keep in mind, this is HS. The athletic fit doesn't really hold water. Or shouldn't. Proximate meets enrollment. That's about the only thing that really matters, or should matter.

 

[AC100]

Willard
Republic
Ozark
Nixa
Glendale
Kickapoo
Webb City
Carthage
Branson


Hillcrest
Central
Parkview
Marshfield
Rogersville
Carl Junction
Neosho
Nevada
Mac County
Monett

This is based on athletic competition more than travel.

 

[AC100]

My dream...

• Nixa
• Ozark
• Republic
• Willard
• Kickapoo
• Glendale
• Parkview
• Central

SPS can decide if they want to add Hillcrest or not. All the outliers can figure it out on their own. It sounds harsh, but man...it's so dumb and antiquated to keep on with this the way it is. That's what, a 30 mile radius. Think of the time, money, and resources saved. Yeah, just makes way too much sense though. And keep in mind, this is HS. The athletic fit doesn't really hold water. Or shouldn't. Proximate meets enrollment. That's about the only thing that really matters, or should matter.

Doing this based on travel is difficult because of Carthage and Webb City. They will want into that league.

 

[AC100]

Now someone find a spot for Joplin lol.

 

[Veer_left]

Willard
Republic
Ozark
Nixa
Glendale
Kickapoo
Webb City
Carthage
Branson


Hillcrest
Central
Parkview
Marshfield
Rogersville
Carl Junction
Neosho
Nevada
Mac County
Monett

This is based on athletic competition more than travel.

What about Joplin?

 

[AC100]

What about Joplin?

They would have to be with the bigger schools. Maybe Branson would want to join the other league.

 

[Baldguy]

What about Joplin?

They should split into two high schools. Had the opportunity in 2011, but now is better than never.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Doing this based on travel is difficult because of Carthage and Webb City. They will want into that league.

They can want in one hand and poop in the other. See which fills up faster. Thank my grandpa for that one. If I'm one of those other 8 or 9 schools, I'm not one bit concerned about Webb, Carthage, Branson, Camdenton, Lebanon...none of them. Why? Because I've got a perfectly good conference right freaking here in my little circle. Again, it makes perfect sense. Which means it will NEVER happen.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

What about Joplin?

Again...If I'm Greene and Christian county, Joplin can kick rocks. Don't care. Joplin (and all the other outliers) can figure it out on their own.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Willard
Republic
Ozark
Nixa
Glendale
Kickapoo
Webb City
Carthage
Branson


Hillcrest
Central
Parkview
Marshfield
Rogersville
Carl Junction
Neosho
Nevada
Mac County
Monett

This is based on athletic competition more than travel.

Competition in what? This isn't the NCAA. These aren't revenue generating sports. Competition has no bearing on it, or shouldn't. Proximity and size (which, in part, helps on the competition), that's it. The travel has these schools spending a ton more money and time. And for what? More revenue? Nope, not at all. It's why, for the most part, educators and coaches are absolutely horrible with finances.

 

[AC100]

1. Lots if school sports travel further for non conference games than conference games by choice. Not everyone cares about travel. When my daughter played high school sports the coach scheduled non conference games that were much further away. He just wanted to play that team and didn't care about travel.

2. Central isn't joining that league. They can't handle the OC. I doubt Parkview or Hillcrest want any part of that either.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Willard
Republic
Ozark
Nixa
Glendale
Kickapoo
Webb City
Carthage
Branson


Hillcrest
Central
Parkview
Marshfield
Rogersville
Carl Junction
Neosho
Nevada
Mac County
Monett

This is based on athletic competition more than travel.

Here's my issue with all of this. When there's a need to be creative, the option is to become resourceful and use everything you can to solve a problem. But there are 8-10 schools in a small circle. They don't need to, and shouldn't be asked to, solve the problems of those far outside of their circle (assuming they would ever choose that route). Their resources are all within an arms reach. Growth and population centers obviously change things. Which is what has happened to make this an option.

 

[Baldguy]

Springfield may have to wait awhile before a true Metro Conference or whatever it'd be. In another decade, Strafford may be big enough to enter the mix. Also, Ozark and Nixa have discussed second high schools in the past; not sure if that is ever coming back on a front burner before long or not. There may be more schools needing a revamp at that future time.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

1. Lots if school sports travel further for non conference games than conference games by choice. Not everyone cares about travel. When my daughter played high school sports the coach scheduled non conference games that were much further away. He just wanted to play that team and didn't care about travel.

2. Central isn't joining that league. They can't handle the OC. I doubt Parkview or Hillcrest want any part of that either.

1. Correct. People that don't value money and time don't care about travel. Coaches probably shouldn't have freedom of scheduling because they don't understand (or care about) the financial aspect of it.

2. Individual schools in SPS don't make their own decisions. Those three schools aren't competing in football in a decent C3 conference. But they'd be just fine in the COC in say, boys basketball. Central would be fine in tennis, golf, soccer, or just about any other "country club" type sport. And don't forget, Kickapoo kind of drives the decision makers of SPS. Again, it'll never happen. But to say it doesn't make sense because competitive balance is more important than money is a really bad business model to follow.

 

[AC100]

One option is football only leagues vs leagues for all other sports. Size matters the most in football because you need a lot more good players to fill all positions. Travel for football is on Friday nights and teams only have 4 or 5 road games a year. Make football leagues based on competition and leagues for all other sports based on geography. You can have the Joplin schools in a non football league and if Webb wants to play Nixa in boys basketball or CJ wants to play Republic in girls basketball just schedule it non conference.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

One option is football only leagues vs leagues for all other sports. Size matters the most in football because you need a lot more good players to fill all positions. Travel for football is on Friday nights and teams only have 4 or 5 road games a year. Make football leagues based on competition and leagues for all other sports based on geography. You can have the Joplin schools in a non football league and if Webb wants to play Nixa in boys basketball or CJ wants to play Republic in girls basketball just schedule it non conference.

I think you’re still complicating something that doesn’t need to be complicated. Time isn’t the only factor. Money is a huge component. And it’s not just the money and time of the district and kids. If I’m a Republic parent, I’m constantly asking my school board member why in the world I’m traveling to the corner of the state when we could be traveling 8 miles to Poo. I get it, you’re from one of the corner of the state schools. And it no doubt has a negative effect on them. But that negative effect shouldn’t be the worry of the Springfield “metro area” schools.

 

[AC100]

Republic football goes to the Joplin area twice a year? I don't think that is a big deal. However sending volleyball on Monday and boys soccer on Tuesday and softball on Thursday I can see as an issue.

I have always heard SPS wants all 5 schools in the same league so that is an issue.

 

[Stimie69er]

There was talk before the tornado that South Middle School on the south side of Joplin would be the site of a second Joplin High School. I haven't heard anything else since but I wonder with the 10,000 housing units they just built near Sam's Club if that will be a reality in the future. Just speculation.

 

[bullitpdq68]

When I was in School in the 80's Nixa had just started their program, Ozark was a tiny school most of those in the COC were smaller than those in the Big 13 at the time which included Carthage Webb City Mac County Nevada Carl Junction Neosho and most of the original Big 8 schools, they the split into the Big 6 and Big 8.

Then Nixa and Ozark exploded along with Republic Willard & Branson. These sort of things have been going on forever.

In 1981 the Ozark conference tried to Kick Joplin Parkwood out as Memorial left to join the Big13.

 

[AC100]

Amazing to think Nixa didn't have football until the early 80s.

In 1979 Nixa started playing junior high games only and added freshman the next year.

 

[Stimie69er]

When I was in School in the 80's Nixa had just started their program, Ozark was a tiny school most of those in the COC were smaller than those in the Big 13 at the time which included Carthage Webb City Mac County Nevada Carl Junction Neosho and most of the original Big 8 schools, they the split into the Big 6 and Big 8.

Then Nixa and Ozark exploded along with Republic Willard & Branson. These sort of things have been going on forever.

In 1981 the Ozark conference tried to Kick Joplin Parkwood out as Memorial left to join the Big13.

This is off subject but I still have a little white football with Parkwood Bears on it that the football team handed out to me and my classmates when we was in first grade just before they went to state in 80'.

 

[AC100]

This is off subject but I still have a little white football with Parkwood Bears on it that the football team handed out to me and my classmates when we was in first grade just before they went to state in 80'.

My dad played for Parkwood in the late 60s for Dewey Combs.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Republic football goes to the Joplin area twice a year? I don't think that is a big deal. However sending volleyball on Monday and boys soccer on Tuesday and softball on Thursday I can see as an issue.

I have always heard SPS wants all 5 schools in the same league so that is an issue.

Two or three, depending on the year. And while I understand it’s not a big deal for you, the resident of one of those five corner of the state schools…don’t you think given the choice, the Republic parent (and about anyone else) would rather travel 15 mins vs 90 mins…times two…then time either two or three depending on the year? I get it, those schools are the losers in this scenario. But what advantage is it to Nixa/Willard/REPMO/Ozark to make that trip even once if the SPS schools are willing to make a metro conference? That’s the question you have to ask yourself. I’ll simplify it for you, there is no advantage for them. None. Btw, I doubt that SPS would be in favor of this. 10-15 yrs ago I could answer that with certainty. I can’t now, but I still doubt they’re up for it.

 

[sw5890]

I think you’re still complicating something that doesn’t need to be complicated. Time isn’t the only factor. Money is a huge component. And it’s not just the money and time of the district and kids. If I’m a Republic parent, I’m constantly asking my school board member why in the world I’m traveling to the corner of the state when we could be traveling 8 miles to Poo. I get it, you’re from one of the corner of the state schools. And it no doubt has a negative effect on them. But that negative effect shouldn’t be the worry of the Springfield “metro area” schools.

Man I agree with you 100%. I get that Carthage and WC want the competition, prestige, whatever from conferencing with those other schools and for football it mostly makes sense but I hate it in pretty much every other sport. Especially in Jr High. I was thrilled beyond measure when CJ and Joplin joined the conference because it meant we'd get more than 1 nearby road game each year.

I may be the only one but I would be totally content here in the "corner" to split off and replace the springfield area with Nevada, McDonald County but I don't know who else. The problem is that these COC schools have absorbed a disproportionate amount of the growth in SWMO so they don't have as many reasonable opponents as they used to, at least not in football. So in that respect I really like the idea of treating football, at least varsity football completely separately.

The thing is conferences seem to be designed around varsity football which of all sports has relatively few games and are always on fridays. So the travel effect is minimal. But every other sport pays the price. Some sports may have 20+ games most of which are not fridays. Many parents have multiple kids between JrH and Varsity. It gets tiring and expensive and I think it makes more sense for Carthage to play a basketball game at Monett or Seneca instead of Branson.

 

[Eagles_Ball]

Man I agree with you 100%. I get that Carthage and WC want the competition, prestige, whatever from conferencing with those other schools and for football it mostly makes sense but I hate it in pretty much every other sport. Especially in Jr High. I was thrilled beyond measure when CJ and Joplin joined the conference because it meant we'd get more than 1 nearby road game each year.

I may be the only one but I would be totally content here in the "corner" to split off and replace the springfield area with Nevada, McDonald County but I don't know who else. The problem is that these COC schools have absorbed a disproportionate amount of the growth in SWMO so they don't have as many reasonable opponents as they used to, at least not in football. So in that respect I really like the idea of treating football, at least varsity football completely separately.

The thing is conferences seem to be designed around varsity football which of all sports has relatively few games and are always on fridays. So the travel effect is minimal. But every other sport pays the price. Some sports may have 20+ games most of which are not fridays. Many parents have multiple kids between JrH and Varsity. It gets tiring and expensive and I think it makes more sense for Carthage to play a basketball game at Monett or Seneca instead of Branson.

You just called me on my pocket aces. If we do “football only”…what about those JV and frosh games on Monday night? Or how about the JH games on Thursday night? It’s just not that simple as to say, ah, we’re just going to make a football conference. Not to mention the logistics nightmare of scheduling two conferences and two conference meetings monthly. Again, what’s in it for the metro area schools? But I agree…as a fan I’d sure as hell rather watch Nixa play Webb than Parkview in football. Basketball? That might be a different story though. And I’m not sure SPS really gives an enormously big damn about the football side of it.

 

[AC100]

Man I agree with you 100%. I get that Carthage and WC want the competition, prestige, whatever from conferencing with those other schools and for football it mostly makes sense but I hate it in pretty much every other sport. Especially in Jr High. I was thrilled beyond measure when CJ and Joplin joined the conference because it meant we'd get more than 1 nearby road game each year.

I may be the only one but I would be totally content here in the "corner" to split off and replace the springfield area with Nevada, McDonald County but I don't know who else. The problem is that these COC schools have absorbed a disproportionate amount of the growth in SWMO so they don't have as many reasonable opponents as they used to, at least not in football. So in that respect I really like the idea of treating football, at least varsity football completely separately.

The thing is conferences seem to be designed around varsity football which of all sports has relatively few games and are always on fridays. So the travel effect is minimal. But every other sport pays the price. Some sports may have 20+ games most of which are not fridays. Many parents have multiple kids between JrH and Varsity. It gets tiring and expensive and I think it makes more sense for Carthage to play a basketball game at Monett or Seneca instead of Branson.

You could get those 7 schools in a corner conference maybe with Monett? Also I guess a conference can't cross state lines but those schools could have a scheduling agreement with Pittsburg. Pittsburg is desperate for local games against similar sized schools.

 

[AC100]

One thing that sucks about COC travel is the junior high volleyball and basketball tournaments. We had to go to Ozark 3 nights in 1 week to play in that thing.