COC nonconference games
- Thread starter AC100
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Just been my ongoing contention (was hoping their upset of LS North who was #1 in KC pretty much all season would get them over the top) they need to schedule up outside that very good league if they are gonna win C6.
This could benefit most of the teams. Even the weaker teams can schedule down too.
So... who is leaving in order to make this possible? Or are they going to eliminate 2 of the "crossover" games?
I get why a team like Nixa with C6 ambitions might want this, at least with their current roster, but what benefit is this to anyone else? The COC west seemed plenty tough for Republic, Carthage and Joplin. I heard some WC fans complaining their schedule was actually too tough, wtf. So I don't see them bringing Rock and Har-Ber back anytime soon.
I actually thought Nixa's post season performance somewhat undermined the argument that it's impossible to get anywhere in C6 without scheduling outside of the COC. Both Nixa and Joplin have done it recently and I'm not sure the outcome would have been any different up against a heavily recruited private school had they played a non-con game in Arkansas or wherever.
Wonder if WC and Carthage try to get CJ and Branson back on their schedule.
I can name them if you want. Neosho, Willard, Glendale, Waynesville, Ozark and Nixa are the ones that want this.
I think CJ might schedule local teams bases on what is a good match up for a 2 year cycle.
This sounds great if they would do it. It'd be nice if they could renew Lebanon-Camdenton and Webb City-Pittsburg, KS, plus maybe some geographical games like Neosho-Mac County, etc.
They may want it too but if it happens it won't be because it's good for them.
Waynesville's problem is they shouldn't be in the COC period. Neosho did just fine. Willard's problem isn't their schedule.
Maybe some good games could come from the arrangement but we'll see how many schools actually do something. There are limited options for these sized schools without a lot of travel. People talk about WC/Pittsburg KS because it used to be a good one but I don't really see it as that competitive anymore and Webb isn't really good enough right now to consider some of their previous non-con opponents. It's completely dumb that Cam/Leb aren't playing each other now, so this would be an opportunity to correct that if a west team was willing to give up that game. Do both teams have to agree to not play or can one just decide to opt out on their own?
So if Nixa pulls two of their COC west games which ones are they? Willard and Neosho were already not scheduled and presumably won't be next year either. The cross division games were the only competitive games Nixa had, if you could call them that.
My guess is Nixa would get Willard and Neosho in the next cycle and would opt out of those.
That seems logical but I don't think that's how it would have played out. Those teams were not selected as opponents in this first arrangement for obvious reasons. I think it's more likely someone says you know what this makes no sense to swap out Repmo and Webb City for Willard and Neosho, let's just keep it as is and everyone is happy. But who knows. I'm interested to see how this unfolds.
Unless Nixa gets the weaker schools on their schedule with the intent of flexing out of those games. Willard and Neosho might want non conference games too.
If Willard and Neosho ended up with Nixa I could see them wanting something different if something different was available. The obvious solution would be put Webb or Joplin or whoever back on the schedule but that doesn't advance Nixa's agenda.
The thing is this all revolves around the assumption that Nixa is the new Webb City. A program that is magnitudes better than everyone else locally. Nixa's team was significantly better this year and probably will be next year as well but is their program as a whole already at that level? Who knows. But I can't fault them for being aggressive and striking while the iron is hot. If they build from this year and start getting more football specific move-ins, win a state champ or two, start playing (and winning) high profile out of state games, it's entirely possible they could dethrone Webb as the premiere football school in SWMO over the next several years.
Really don't understand the whole Nixa superiority complex thing. Yes, they are very good.....right now. They have one crazy talented very impressive kid. and that somehow makes you a NATIONAL POWERHOUSE? They cant even win a state title in Missouri, a state not exactly know for national level football.
The end of some pretty old/big rivalries is probably the biggest loss from the end of the Ozark Conference. I had the privilege of going to a couple of Camdenton/Lebanon games over the years and the place is always packed with thousands of people. Really cool environment!
To be honest, I've always thought the COC reorganization was a big mistake. Had the Ozark and COC remained separate after losing their members to the OMC, they would have already had one or two non-conference spots in their schedules. But it seems both leagues members wanted to have an immediate, quick-response to the departing schools that really wasn't necessary.
Follow up question to your comment which I agree with and thank you for pointing it out ... I have read comments on this board throughout the season that spoke about the COC being "down" this year. How could the COC be down when the only changes were dropping CJ and Branson and adding Glendale, Kickapoo, Waynesville and Lebanon?
In 2023, Nixa (regular season games only) initiated the turbo clock in three games (Branson, CJ, Ozark).
In 2024, Nixa (regular season games only) initiated the turbo clock in eight games (RepMo, Webb, Joplin, Lebanon, Kickapoo, Waynesville, Ozark and Glendale) obviously everyone but Carthage.
I don't understand how this translates into the league being down as much as Nixa was obviously very, very good.
The COC lost the only Class 4 school in Carl Junction to the OMG (Nixa was 5-3 vs. CJ and only three of those games were turbo clocks).
The COC lost a Class 5 opponent in Branson to the OMG and Nixa was 8-0 vs. Branson with five of those games being turbo clock during the same time period (since CJ joined the COC in 2016).
Just some of the Nixa faithful not the majority of Nixa. That small portion right now is still blaming the loss on the "private school" malarkey.
None of them carry the weight Nixa does. Not even close. The only one that has a voice is Ozark, and it's pretty minimal these days.
They're not a national powerhouse, as you say, but they're a good bit better than anyone in this area.
Every school in the conference that was any good wasn't as good as they had been in recent previous years. Carthage, Webb, Republic, Poo...all worse than recent years. Couple that with Waynesville, Glendale, and Willard being about as bad as a team could be given their level...it's all pretty much a recipe for a down year.
There are some people who REALLY want Nixa to be a powerhouse. The Springfield media has a big time boner for Nixa athletics, I think they view them as the school most likely to deliver special content to cover. This was easily the best team for Nixa EVER and simultaneously the other COC powers were all down. Carthage, Joplin, Republic were all good but not like what they have been recently. Webb was a dumpster fire. So it wasn't a fantastic sample. One friend I have (from Nixa) says they will be similar next year and maybe the year after but he thinks they'll be very "normal" after that.
A lot of the comments I've heard seem premature if not egotistical, I heard guys saying a year or two ago they needed to be scheduling "big national level teams" which I found absurd given at the time they weren't even able to beat Carthage or Joplin, or at least not convincingly. And they had basically zero post season resume.
However if they want to win a state title in C6 I do think they could benefit from some tougher competition, if you want to be the best you have to play the best right? I think what grinds some people is the assertion that programs like Bixby or whoever are Nixas peers now and the COC is suddenly beneath them.
Also makes the playoffs extremely difficult for Nixa come Class 6 playoff time. Not only are they the only really good Class 6 school in the area, but the Class 5 teams they played weren't great (at least not comparatively). Killing everyone all season isn't usually a recipe for success when you get into those tough games. If they continue to be much better than their competition, I wonder what they decide to do when it comes to regular season schedule.
Honestly Waynesville, Camdenton, Parkview ,Rolla, Central and Willard would work.
LOL Waynesville fits perfectly fine in the COC. They are down right now, big freaking deal. They fit enrollment and facility wise. Every conference is going to have someone at the top and someone at the bottom.
My problem with Waynesville isn't their competitiveness or facilities, I agree they are fine by those terms. Too many people seem to think if a team isn't in the top of their conference the problem is they are in the wrong conference.
My problem with W'ville is their terrible geography. Half the conference is closer to Kansas City and Tulsa than to Waynesville. They are OK for the springfield half of the league but it's dumb for them and their opponents to be crossing 2/3 of the state to play a tuesday night basketball game. In football, I guess it's not any worse than when they having to play Lafayette to fill a non-con week.
Carthage freshman and JV football plays CJ instead of Waynesville the week that varsity plays Waynesville. Waynesville might not have a consistent enough student population to complete in the COC.
Not sure what you mean by student population since they are only smaller than Nixa and Joplin I believe.
Surely they have to start trying to fit in a KC or StL area power or two on the schedule as it is similar travel time to/from either place.
61% of the Waynesville student population is military-dependent, and this is coming from their school website. Another 12% have parents that at least work on base in civilian positions. The athletic talent pool I'm sure depends heavily on military migration. The state title in 2007 occurred in the middle of the war years. Whether that played into any of it, who knows, but the talent doesn't seem to be coming as it did then. With that lack of guaranteed athletes that will stay for 4 or more years, it could be hard to build anything, and especially in a tough conference. Even with their size, they may be a better fit in the Ozark Mountain, rather than the COC.
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