ADVERTISEMENT

Articles of Impeachment Don't Meet Constitutional Standard

Veerman_12

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2019
3,054
2,791
113
Constitutional law expert and Harvard professor emeritus Alan Dershowitz harshly criticized the articles of impeachment against President Donald Trump presented by the Democrats as unconstitutional and damaging to the rule of law in an op-ed in The Hill on Tuesday.

Neither of the two articles – abuse of power and obstruction of Congress – presented by the Democrats “satisfies the express constitutional criteria for impeachment,” as both are not crimes or even mentioned in the Constitution.

This means that the Democrats are placing themselves above the Constitution, he wrote.

Dershowitz argued that both articles of impeachment “are so vague and open-ended that they could be applied in partisan fashion by a majority of the House against almost any president from the opposing party.”

He added this notion is exactly what the framers sought to avoid – a decision to impeach based on “the comparative strength of parties,” rather than on “innocence or guilt.”

Dershowitz stressed that the duty of legislators in the House should be “to support, defend and apply the Constitution as written, not as it can be stretched to fit the actions of an opposition or unpopular president.”

He went on to contend that if the House votes for impeachment on these articles, it should be declared “void,” because as Alexander Hamilton stated in Federalist 78, “no legislative act… contrary to the Constitution, can be valid.”

As I stated in another thread, abuse of power and "obstruction of Congress" are such vague "charges" I envision a future in which Congress turns into nothing but an obstructionist branch of government and they spend their time doing nothing but removing opposition parties from power.

This isn't a defense of Trump, this is a defense of common sense, rule of law, and the way our Republic was intended to function.

Congress is broken and I have no idea what the answer is.
 
Constitutional law expert and Harvard professor emeritus Alan Dershowitz harshly criticized the articles of impeachment against President Donald Trump presented by the Democrats as unconstitutional and damaging to the rule of law in an op-ed in The Hill on Tuesday.

Neither of the two articles – abuse of power and obstruction of Congress – presented by the Democrats “satisfies the express constitutional criteria for impeachment,” as both are not crimes or even mentioned in the Constitution.

This means that the Democrats are placing themselves above the Constitution, he wrote.

Dershowitz argued that both articles of impeachment “are so vague and open-ended that they could be applied in partisan fashion by a majority of the House against almost any president from the opposing party.”

He added this notion is exactly what the framers sought to avoid – a decision to impeach based on “the comparative strength of parties,” rather than on “innocence or guilt.”

Dershowitz stressed that the duty of legislators in the House should be “to support, defend and apply the Constitution as written, not as it can be stretched to fit the actions of an opposition or unpopular president.”

He went on to contend that if the House votes for impeachment on these articles, it should be declared “void,” because as Alexander Hamilton stated in Federalist 78, “no legislative act… contrary to the Constitution, can be valid.”

As I stated in another thread, abuse of power and "obstruction of Congress" are such vague "charges" I envision a future in which Congress turns into nothing but an obstructionist branch of government and they spend their time doing nothing but removing opposition parties from power.

This isn't a defense of Trump, this is a defense of common sense, rule of law, and the way our Republic was intended to function.

Congress is broken and I have no idea what the answer is.
I think Dershowitz is informative. He's a classical liberal. He is not liked now and we can guess why.
 
  • Like
Reactions: millerbleach
Constitutional law expert and Harvard professor emeritus Alan Dershowitz harshly criticized the articles of impeachment against President Donald Trump presented by the Democrats as unconstitutional and damaging to the rule of law in an op-ed in The Hill on Tuesday.

Neither of the two articles – abuse of power and obstruction of Congress – presented by the Democrats “satisfies the express constitutional criteria for impeachment,” as both are not crimes or even mentioned in the Constitution.

This means that the Democrats are placing themselves above the Constitution, he wrote.

Dershowitz argued that both articles of impeachment “are so vague and open-ended that they could be applied in partisan fashion by a majority of the House against almost any president from the opposing party.”
Haha dershowitz

Oj was innocent too
He added this notion is exactly what the framers sought to avoid – a decision to impeach based on “the comparative strength of parties,” rather than on “innocence or guilt.”

Dershowitz stressed that the duty of legislators in the House should be “to support, defend and apply the Constitution as written, not as it can be stretched to fit the actions of an opposition or unpopular president.”

He went on to contend that if the House votes for impeachment on these articles, it should be declared “void,” because as Alexander Hamilton stated in Federalist 78, “no legislative act… contrary to the Constitution, can be valid.”

As I stated in another thread, abuse of power and "obstruction of Congress" are such vague "charges" I envision a future in which Congress turns into nothing but an obstructionist branch of government and they spend their time doing nothing but removing opposition parties from power.

This isn't a defense of Trump, this is a defense of common sense, rule of law, and the way our Republic was intended to function.

Congress is broken and I have no idea what the answer is.

Dershowitz?
He got oj off
 
  • Like
Reactions: BigMODog
JFC. Alan Dershowitz? He has been making excuses for everything Trump has done for 2 years. And why? He got his pee pee serviced by raping Epstein’s sex slaves and that is common knowledge. But he swears “he never took off his underwear”. This is the man you choose to defend Trump? That says something.
I'm primarily referring to the Pre-Trump era. I don't know about his drunken behavior at Marthas Vineyard parties or Epstein's sex slaves. It could be easily true and just as easily false. He wrote a book in support of Trump, and he is a law contributor to Fox's opinion channels. I am supposed to care about his sexual escapades but I don't. If he has hurt a woman then dam him. I do not know.
 
JFC. Alan Dershowitz? He has been making excuses for everything Trump has done for 2 years. And why? He got his pee pee serviced by raping Epstein’s sex slaves and that is common knowledge. But he swears “he never took off his underwear”. This is the man you choose to defend Trump? That says something.

As stated previously, this is not a defense of Trump, it's a defense of the process.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BigMODog
In a just country, Mulvaney and all the others would have to testify. But this country is as corrupt as Ukraine and most of the others we look down our noses at.

Mulvaney, Rudy, and Trump all three admitted Trump withheld cash to get Ukraine to hose the Bidens. That is indisputable. If you think that is Ok, then we have a debate.

There is no other debate. Stop complaining about a president being investigated. It should all be transparent. There should be oversight.
 
In a just country, Mulvaney and all the others would have to testify. But this country is as corrupt as Ukraine and most of the others we look down our noses at.

Mulvaney, Rudy, and Trump all three admitted Trump withheld cash to get Ukraine to hose the Bidens. That is indisputable. If you think that is Ok, then we have a debate.

There is no other debate. Stop complaining about a president being investigated. It should all be transparent. There should be oversight.
Duck if you hate this country so much you just need to pack your crap up and move to Russia with your boy Bernie as soon as he loses again
 
  • Like
Reactions: millerbleach
Yet you're on username 4654456665
Welcome back to ignore.

Dershowitz is trash

I'm not wrong. You cant refute the argument and you love the liberals so much so you'll stoop to logical fallacies in order to be a complete and utter troll. Ignore me, that does me a favor, I don't have to hear your idiocy on my posts.
 
Last edited:
As stated previously, this is not a defense of Trump, it's a defense of the process.
The process was done by the same rules as the pubs had for the Clinton impeachment. All that whining about not having his lawyers his or his witnesses is BS and you know it. That was all to get the base all wound up. The house does impeachment, the trial will be in the senate just as it is supposed to be. That is where Trump can have lawyers and call witnesses. Now the pubs say they don't want to call any witnesses at all, they just want to vote to aquit and be done wait it as soon as possible.
 
I'm a new member, so I would like to offer fresh insight...

I have one question that I have not heard the answer to;

What diplomat purpose or matter of national security was served by President Trump's insistence that President Zelinsky make a public announcement that the Bidens were being investigated??

That is an undisputed FACT straight out of Trump's mouth. Forget about second and third hand testimony, and that Zelinsky never made the public statement.The FACT that our President was insisting that the president of a foreign country make that statement serves no other purpose than to smear a political rival in our next election by suspicion and innuendo, as this statement was to be made before any investigation would even begin.

That FACT is the definition of "abuse of power". Is it impeachable? I don't know. I do know our Senate will vote along party lines and will not impeach.

But no one can answer my question.
 
I'm a new member, so I would like to offer fresh insight...

I have one question that I have not heard the answer to;

What diplomat purpose or matter of national security was served by President Trump's insistence that President Zelinsky make a public announcement that the Bidens were being investigated??

That is an undisputed FACT straight out of Trump's mouth. Forget about second and third hand testimony, and that Zelinsky never made the public statement.The FACT that our President was insisting that the president of a foreign country make that statement serves no other purpose than to smear a political rival in our next election by suspicion and innuendo, as this statement was to be made before any investigation would even begin.

That FACT is the definition of "abuse of power". Is it impeachable? I don't know. I do know our Senate will vote along party lines and will not impeach.

But no one can answer my question.

The Democrats need to focus on their own mental health issues. Pelosi, Schitz, Schumer, Nadler, and all the victim Olympics champions running for president in 2020 should take Socialism, Russia Hoax, and the Impeachment scam to the children's table where it belongs.
 
I'm a new member, so I would like to offer fresh insight...

I have one question that I have not heard the answer to;

What diplomat purpose or matter of national security was served by President Trump's insistence that President Zelinsky make a public announcement that the Bidens were being investigated??

That is an undisputed FACT straight out of Trump's mouth. Forget about second and third hand testimony, and that Zelinsky never made the public statement.The FACT that our President was insisting that the president of a foreign country make that statement serves no other purpose than to smear a political rival in our next election by suspicion and innuendo, as this statement was to be made before any investigation would even begin.

That FACT is the definition of "abuse of power". Is it impeachable? I don't know. I do know our Senate will vote along party lines and will not impeach.

But no one can answer my question.

I will answer your question if you show me who heard Trump say that there would be no meeting unless an announcement was made that the Bidens and the Bidens alone were being investigated.
I;ll grant you that Trump withheld the meeting unless they announced they were looking into several corruption issues but i'm not aware of any testimony from a not anonymous, first hand, witness this was just about the Bidens. If you can't produce that, you question is invalid.
 
Well, you got me there millerbleach, Trump never said it in front of a microphone. I thought that it was accepted that was part of Trump's demand. Sondland and Vindman, whom I believe, testified that Guiliani told them that Trump was insisting on the public announcement. Then Guiliani should be forced to testify at the impeachment.
If we want the truth, and I hope the majority of Senators do, then force everyone to testify with any knowledge, including the Bidens. I have no tolerance for any corrupt politician (I hate corrupt Hillary.)
So does the Godfather telling the consiglierre to tell the underbosses excuse the Don?
 
Well, you got me there millerbleach, Trump never said it in front of a microphone. I thought that it was accepted that was part of Trump's demand. Sondland and Vindman, whom I believe, testified that Guiliani told them that Trump was insisting on the public announcement. Then Guiliani should be forced to testify at the impeachment.
If we want the truth, and I hope the majority of Senators do, then force everyone to testify with any knowledge, including the Bidens. I have no tolerance for any corrupt politician (I hate corrupt Hillary.)
So does the Godfather telling the consiglierre to tell the underbosses excuse the Don?

There are emails. And they aren’t Hillary’s. If McConnell asks for documents and witnesses, Pence will be sworn in by March.

A previously blacked-out White House email calls the hold on military aid to Ukraine a “clear direction” from President Trump, a national security site reports
 
Last edited:
Well, you got me there millerbleach, Trump never said it in front of a microphone. I thought that it was accepted that was part of Trump's demand. Sondland and Vindman, whom I believe, testified that Guiliani told them that Trump was insisting on the public announcement. Then Guiliani should be forced to testify at the impeachment.
If we want the truth, and I hope the majority of Senators do, then force everyone to testify with any knowledge, including the Bidens. I have no tolerance for any corrupt politician (I hate corrupt Hillary.)
So does the Godfather telling the consiglierre to tell the underbosses excuse the Don?
This is a massively popular strategy that will surely vault the Democrats to 0% approval and I don't care if you die love letters. :rolleyes: The consigliere is spelled c-o-n-s-i-g-l-i-e-r-e.
 
Well, you got me there millerbleach, Trump never said it in front of a microphone. I thought that it was accepted that was part of Trump's demand. Sondland and Vindman, whom I believe, testified that Guiliani told them that Trump was insisting on the public announcement. Then Guiliani should be forced to testify at the impeachment.
If we want the truth, and I hope the majority of Senators do, then force everyone to testify with any knowledge, including the Bidens. I have no tolerance for any corrupt politician (I hate corrupt Hillary.)
So does the Godfather telling the consiglierre to tell the underbosses excuse the Don?
I never said a direct quote from Trump. I said direct testimony of first hand knowledge. I also am unaware of testimony Rudy told anyone this. Maybe you could provide some quotes on that.
I'm all in favor of EVERYONE testifying. I think the President is entitled to confront his accusers not just anonymous accusations. I'm confident anyone you can call will support Trumps claims.
 
"The unredacted emails... show that the Pentagon was sounding all the alarms that the hold on the aid was illegal and in fact would compromise the ability to send the full funds to Ukraine, and that the OMB essentially was covering it up" - Ryan Goodman
 
Sorry miller, I know what I heard in testimony and don't feel the need to sift thru pages of testimony to prove my post. It doesn't matter what was said in House hearings anyway, the Senate trial is the big show. I only hope it is a thorough trial with both sides presenting their cases and exhausting all evidence. But I have my doubts about that happening.
 
"The unredacted emails... show that the Pentagon was sounding all the alarms that the hold on the aid was illegal and in fact would compromise the ability to send the full funds to Ukraine, and that the OMB essentially was covering it up" - Ryan Goodman
Who is Ryan Goodman? What unredacted e-mails? Give me facts not opinions and interpretations. The accusations are stated as fact so it shouldn't be hard.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BigMODog
Sorry miller, I know what I heard in testimony and don't feel the need to sift thru pages of testimony to prove my post. It doesn't matter what was said in House hearings anyway, the Senate trial is the big show. I only hope it is a thorough trial with both sides presenting their cases and exhausting all evidence. But I have my doubts about that happening.
Once again, I can't go by what you or anyone else heard said. I need a direct quote or someone who heard it first hand.
I do too and ain't holding my breath. Politicians always get it wrong. What the Dems did in the House was a political stunt and what the Pubs in the Senate do will likely be too.
 
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT